About Technology Industry

BNET Technology provides daily industry trends and news coverage with insights for managers and executives about all aspects of the high-tech industry. In addition to detailed tech company profiles, we bring you industry analysis on new mergers and acquisitions, tech products, investments, patents, and a host of other important technology related business issues.

SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending [UPDATED]

By Erik Sherman | Jun 24, 2009

When you hear corporations beating their chests over their competitive position, there’s always a good bet they are trying to make things look sunnier. My colleague Michael Hickins caught Oracle in posturing. But he mentioned SAP claiming that, where it competes with Oracle, it was “doing very well, thank you.” So I dug up SAP’s last financial statement, and if that’s doing well, I’d hate to be doing badly.

Here’s what Michael noted about Oracle:

Oracle held its own in database and middleware revenues, where it doesn’t compete with SAP, but in applications, where it does go head to head with the business applications vendor, new license sales declined almost 20 percent and total applications, including support and license updates, declined by 9 percent. It was able to make up some of that ground thanks to twelve percent growth in license updates and product support for middleware and databases.

So how has SAP done? It depends on how you look at things. In its last released financial statement for the quarter that closed March 31, 2009, total revenue was down three percent, compared to Oracle’s nine percent. But look at the details:

Software revenue was down by a full third, dwarfing even the drop that Oracle saw. Subscription and other service revenue was actually up by 27 percent, but that was only an increase from $€56 million to $€71 million compared to the $€204 million drop in software sales. Even if Oracle wanted to claim that customers were switching to a service-based model, they clearly weren’t doing so at anywhere near the pace of the purchasing plunge. Training revenue was down by 31 percent, professional service revenue by nine percent. The only thing that was up, and the only thing that helped keep the overall revenue number from looking worse, was an 18 percent increase in support revenue. Had service revenue even stayed flat, SAP revenue would have been down by 10.4 percent year over year.

And now to SAP’s claim in May that it was addressing price increases by setting up benchmarks with its user group.

The measures focus on support provided by SAP after purchase, which is a sore spot for customers — and vendors who want to have happy reference customers. In many cases, customers are pretty much left to their own devices once they’ve paid for the software license — a key contention of software-as-a-service (SaaS) vendors who claim a subscription model forces them to take better care of their customers. (The SAP benchmarking agreement, however, doesn’t include promised feature sets that aren’t delivered and upgrade cycles that lag, but that’s material for a separate post.)

SAP boasted that Oracle customers were already paying 22 percent of contract value for support, but that SAP wouldn’t be raising its prices to that level until 2015. What it didn’t include is that SAP was only reacting to a user revolt when it tried increasing the fees far earlier than that just under a year ago, and in February 2008 raised maintenance fees for all new customers.

Quick, how do you tell that an enterprise software vendor is … mm, deforming the truth? Its spokesperson’s mouth is moving.

Image via stock.xchng user weirdvis, site standard license.

Erik Sherman is a freelance journalist whose work has appeared in Newsweek, the New York Times Magazine, Technology Review, the Financial Times, Chief Executive, and other publications. Follow him on Twitter.

BNET User Analysis

Web Buzz:
  • What are YouTube and Hulu Really Getting?

    BNET Technology - 193 days 18 hours 10 minutes ago

    My colleague Michael Hickins has an Print

  • IBM's Secret Upside for SPSS Acquisition â?? Smart Infrastructure

    BNET Technology - 101 days 15 hours 8 minutes ago

    My colleague Michael Hickins was right when he said that IBM’s acquisition of SPSS helped it get its hands on a rapidly growing market. But the real upside is not in depriving SAP of an area of business intelligence that it might have been smart in wanting. The big win is that IBM gets to integrate what SPSS can do into what Big Blue knows...

  • Facebook's FriendFeed Fancy -- Maybe Not Completely Dumb

    BNET Technology - 88 days 19 hours 48 minutes ago

    Yesterday, Facebook went shopping and picked up some FriendFeed. Many, including my colleague Michael Hickins, are shaking their heads in disbelief over how unwise an acquisition this likely was. And I can’t completely disagree, as there’s a lot of evidence for this strategic view. But the result may not be quite as terrible as all that. I...

  • Can Apple Have A Netbook Its Way?

    BNET Technology - 169 days 13 hours 18 minutes ago

    The rumors are flying that Apple is preparing a tablet form netbook, as noted Larry Dignan at our sister site ZDNet. And as my colleague Michael Hickins so correctly notes, the company has multiple good reasons to make the push. But I think ultimately it are doomed to failure, caught in the cross fire of the current market’s dynamics and a...

  • Economists and Social Media: Using Twitter, LinkedIn and Blogs to Network and Build Value

    Krishna De's BizGrowth News - 47 days 23 hours 34 minutes ago

    ‘Why bother with social media?’ id a very common question I hear from business people. Well that’s the question I also put to Ronan Lyons and Irish Economist who I met at the Future Focus conference in Dublin a few months ago. We caught up at the end of the conference so you will hear the contruction

Links from the Web Buzz:
 
Reply to Story

BNET TalkbackShare your ideas and expertise on this topic

Subscribe to this discussion via Email or RSS

  •  
    1

    kganil

    06/25/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Erik,

    While you have sided with Oracle to negate Michael's support to SAP, to make any sense out of your commentary, please compare SAP and Oracle's app sales figures side by side and then give us your expert opinion. While using % figures to illustrate growth, please do evaluate the baseline $ figures on which the %'s are applied (for eg., when Oracle or SAP says they grew their app revenue by 20%, what?s the baseline from which they grew ?...a 20% growth on $ 200 million sales and 10% growth on $ 2 billion sales gives a different dimension to blind claims by vendors on % growth

    regards, A George

  •  
    2

    ErikSherman

    06/25/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    If you'll read both my piece and Michael's again, you'll see that I'm not "siding with Oracle." I explicitly noted that Michael had let the air out of Oracle's claims. I simply did the same for SAPs. In other words, there is no "winner" here.

    As for percentage growth -- even if negative -- or course it depends on the base. If you look at Oracle's 2009 Q3 10-Q, you'll notice that roughly 26% of its revenue comes from application sales, or $396 million for the Dec. 08 - Feb. 09 quarter, which is as close a match-up to SAP's Jan-Mar quarter as you're going to get. Contraction in that segment was 12 percent, which makes the SAP numbers comparable in scope and far worse in comparative performance.

  •  
    3

    andy.waroma@...

    06/25/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Dear Eric,

    Since when has 1 Euro been 1 US Dollar ("an increase from $56 million to $71 million compared to the $204"). The SAP stament of income is in Euros. I was hoping that your rigorous analysis would have at least gotten the currencies right.

  •  
    4

    ErikSherman

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Ah, correct you are - my mistake in rushing through the writing and performing the finanical equivalent of a typo.

  •  
    5

    andy.waroma@...

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Thank you Eric,

    It's bit more than a financial typo when you continue in your response: "$396 million for the Dec. 08 - Feb. 09 quarter, which is as close a match-up to SAP's Jan-Mar quarter as you're going to get". So converting E 418M to USD (http://finance.yahoo.com/currency-converter#from=EUR;to=USD;amt=418) you get around USD 587M. USD 396M does not sound that close anymore then, or does it?

  •  
    6

    ErikSherman

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    It's a typo because I used a dollar sign instead of the euro sign. And, yes, it does sound close. As you noted, I wrote that it was as close a match-up as you could get - and it is, because you're now comparing the application sales of Oracle to the application sales of SAP. That's an apples-to-apples comparison. Both sales figures are in in the same order of magnitude. Although one is larger than the other, in terms of business analysis, you would certainly compare the two applications businesses. Or are you suggesting that you shoudln't be able to compare the two businesses? Given that so far as I know they're the two big market share leaders in this market, I don't see how you could not.

  •  
    7

    andy.waroma@...

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Dear Eric,

    I agree with your comparison base for the revenue. I'm just pointing out that in this case the apples-to-apples comparison was done in pounds and kilos. In my dictionary when the other company does almost 1.5 times more application sales than the other, it does not really qualify to be called "as close as you're going to get"; but maybe I need a new one?All the best Eric and thank you for your article.

  •  
    8

    SAPAE

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Let's just call a spade a spade - the other article is slanted,
    this article is slanted, it is what it is. You saw an opportunity
    to stir the pot and you took it, OK.

    But Andy brings up the dagger here - how can you claim
    $587M is "comparable" to $396M? One is 48% bigger.

    Take a boxing analogy. COMPARABLE means the same class,
    which in boxing means anywhere from 4-7 lbs on average.

    Comparing SAP's revenues to Oracle's apps revenue, at a
    48% difference, would essentially be like putting a mini-
    flyweight (or a junior highschooler) in the ring with Floyd
    Mayweather. Or for those who arent boxing fans, Mike Tyson
    in his prime fighting a 140lb lightweight. Comparable? Fair?

    The WBC would never ever even dream of comparing those
    fighters, nevermind letting them box. What if they were the 2
    most popular fighters in the world? Nope, still not gonna
    happen, no comparison.

    SAP is the market leader, ORCL is second. Nothing more,
    nothing less - it is what it is. SAP has 48% more revenue in
    the "apps" space than ORCL.

    Statistics can all be manipulated anyway. What does ORCL
    count as "applications" versus what SAP counts. What is truly
    "software as a service" when there are so many hybrid models
    out there. Maybe some revenue streams count for ORCL, and
    some dont for SAP, or vice versa.

    My point is, we'll never know these details so why speculate.
    Let the shareholders compare financials. It doesnt do a thing
    to prove one vendors commitment, viability, and penchant for
    success in a given industry or segment of the market. Show
    me one single customer that bases a strategic decision to run
    their business on a given platform around a vendors share
    price, and I'll join you in the ring of comparing revenues.
    Articles like this do nothing more than draw attention away
    from the fact that SAP has a superior offering for those
    customers looking to take their business to the next level
    through an integrated, ever improving platform from a vendor
    who is focused on organic business application development.
    This results in direct value to the customer and ORCL will
    never be able to touch that given their business model. Am I
    biased? Sure, but its only because I truly believe in SAP.

    But I digress.

    Im not coming at you about the article - I thought it was a
    good response to a low blow. Im coming at you regarding
    your backpedaling response to Andy...come on now, just
    admit, your point of revenue comparison is way off target,
    damaging the credibility of your writing. Do a deeper analysis
    and there may be something of value there to support your
    claims, but that particular ship has sailed.

    $587M>$396M...significantly.

  •  
    9

    ErikSherman

    06/26/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    Sorry, but if you're comparing the two major companies in a given market, you compare them based, to the degree you can find, on their head-to-head sales based on the numbers available. Now, maybe you're suggesting that I shouldn't compare Oracle's application sales to SAP, but I can't imagine what argument you could make to support that. I said it was as close a comparison as was possible, and it was. One is ahead of the other by nearly 50%. You can still compare them. One saw a much steeper decline in software sales than the other. That is relevant. In the case of business, two major businesses that each sell in the hundreds of millions of a given product type in one quarter are comparable. If you don't see that, then there's nothing more I can say to get you to see it. But you can bet that both Oracle and SAP eye each other carefully in this market as their nearest comparable competitors. And I'm certainly not going to get into the kool-aid-drinking, cheerleading, factional insistance that one vendor or the other is "obviously" better. Next thing you know, you'd want me to start counting myself as either in the Microsoft or Apple camp. I'm happy to consider the business issues and will avoid that particular form of madness, thanks.

  •  
    10

    SAPAE

    06/29/09 | Report as spam

    RE: SAP FUD: Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt -- and Truth Bending

    "Both sales figures are in in the same order of magnitude"

    This is the problem anyone reading this article should have
    with your comparison. I'll quote the above post again in case
    you missed it the first time, because I feel the exact same
    way.

    You have done well to avoid "that particular form of madness"
    in not clearly displaying a favorite, but your other form of
    madness is in full effect. Thats the one where your foot is so
    far in your mouth you cant see or taste it.

    "Both sales figures are in in the same order of magnitude"

    It was an erroneous comparison - as I said, if you dig into the
    numbers one could make a claim based on growth/contraction
    or whatever other statistical play-dough may exist, but that
    particular argument blew up on you.

    I'll repeat the above posters comment again as it sums up my
    response well too:

    "In my dictionary when the other company does almost 1.5
    times more application sales than the other, it does not really
    qualify to be called "as close as you're going to get"; but
    maybe I need a new one?All the best Eric and thank you for
    your article."

Please add your comment:

  1. You are currently: a Guest |
  2.  

Basic HTML tags that work in comments are: bold (<b></b>), italic (<i></i>), underline (<u></u>), and hyperlink (<a href></a)

advertisement
advertisement
  • Click Here
  • Click Here
  • Click Here
advertisement